On October 11th, Running with Scissors will hit the big screen. The film is the cinematic debut of Nip/Tuck creator, Ryan Murphy. With the movie finished and his next project not yet begun, Ryan took time to sit down with me and answer some questions. Here, as an Augusten dot com exclusive, is the first in-depth interview with Ryan Murphy.
AUGUSTEN:
Many actresses in Hollywood complain that there aren’t enough great parts for women. Yet your script for Running with Scissors featured complex, multidimensional roles for three generations of women. Are you out to change the landscape for women actors in Hollywood?
RYAN:
It’s interesting, the three generations of women, isn’t it? We have Annette in the movie, Gwyneth, Jill Clayburgh, and the hot young It Girl, Evan Rachel Wood. The great thing about casting this movie was, particularly for the women, all these women read the script and said yes immediately. When we were shooting, they would all remark how great it was to show up and play these MULTIDIMENSIONAL women…who got to laugh, cry, be emotional, be angry. You know, be real people, not just decor. So many times now, the girl parts in movies are just there to support the guy. And these women characters are in the movie to certainly support Augusten, but they all have these great arcs and journeys. That’s the way you wrote them in the book, and that’s the way I tried to adapt your work. The women in this movie is always the first thing people comment on too, when they see it. Like how great it is to see Jill Clayburgh, and how it’s exciting to see Gwyneth play an old maid character, and, of course, how awesome and brave Annette is. I love directing and writing women’s parts, just because women are, I think, more free in their emotions. They will go further. I hope I am changing the landscape for women actors…only in that I love writing these parts! And my next movie is sort of in the vein of “Running,” in that it’s women galore! It’s called “Dirty Tricks,” based on the play. It’s kind of The Women set in Watergate. It will star Meryl Streep, Annette, Jill, and Sharon Stone.
A: So often, authors are unhappy with the film adaptations of their work. But when I saw Running with Scissors for the first time I was completely blown away. It was better than I expected. Is it better than you expected?
R: I don’t really know. I was terrified of your reaction, so when you loved it and were so emotional, I felt, well…if nothing else, I kind of did my job. Which was when we met, I told you I would make my version of your story, and protect your characters, and not villainize anybody, and make you be so much a part of it all, which you were. Do people know you basically approved all the sets, the buttons, the costumes, and the actors? Well, they should. My first cut of the movie was two hours and forty minutes! It was too much. Now, it’s two hours exactly. Of course, I miss some things I cut, but I’m so proud of the movie, and the actors. I set out to make your story, which in this case was the story of a boy and his mother, and how they loved each other and lost each other, and I think I can honestly say I did just that. The stuff I did cut will be out on the directors cut DVD.
A: I had to keep reminding myself, this is his first film. For the rest of your life, you will make films, but Running with Scissors will always be your first film. Why did you choose it?
R: You know, when I read the book, it was just like I was hit by lightning. Every molecule in me cried out, ONLY YOU CAN MAKE THIS MOVIE. I wanted it so badly, and I flew out to New York and met you, and I think I said after our five-hour dinner, “I will not leave this table until you give me the rights.” And something in you trusted me, and you did. It just hit me on so many levels. Largely, I think, because we have so much in common. We grew up in the 70s, we have similar mothers, we’re both gay, we’re both writers, we both worship glamour of all kinds, and, of course, all shiny things. The book just spoke to me immediately, because I saw my personal journey in it, which was the search for family. I wrote that one word FAMILY on a note card and posted it on my computer when I wrote the script. I don’t think that feeling will overtake me ever again, the way it did when I first read your book. It was just like love at first sight. I keep searching for that obsessed feeling. Maybe one day it will come again. I doubt it. And, of course, you never forget your first love…
A: After I saw the film I told somebody, “This is Annette Bening’s finest performance.” And that’s saying a hell of a lot, but I think I’m objective and I think I’m right. Do you agree?
R: Well, I agree with you. I do think it’s her greatest performance, and that’s saying a lot, because she’s always brilliant. I showed the film recently to Warren Beatty, Annette’s husband, and he’s a very tough cookie. He absolutely loved the film, and when it was over he turned to her and me and said the same thing you did…that Deirdre is her greatest performance. I think it was certainly one of her hardest as well. She put herself through hell making the movie. It’s not easy playing a manic depressive bi-polar psychotic. I mean, she really had to go to those places and be brave with no vanity and I was always shocked at how she did. Some of the scenes are so brutal, and she would just show up and knock them out of the park. The crew would literally applaud some of her takes, she was so fearless. And it was also so hard on her, because Annette has four children, and playing a mother who literally gives her child away was very difficult emotionally for her. Some days, she’d show up and it seemed like she was crying for 12 hours straight! But for me, she was the perfect choice, because in this part, she gets to do everything. She gets to be funny and sweet and bitchy and glamorous and then just full-out crazy and medicated. I truly think she’s the only one who could have done it. Her range is astonishing. And I think when people see her in it they will say it is an Annette Bening they’ve never seen before. I mean, her own husband said that, and that’s saying a lot.
A: What did you learn from Annette?
R: The thing I learned the most from Annette was RESEARCH and PREPARATION. She was always the most prepared, and because she had done so much research into mental illness prior to filming, she could offer choices. That inspired me. When we were rehearsing the scene when Dr. Finch first shows up to the house and gives her Valium for the first time, thus getting her hooked on drugs, Annette turned to me and said, “Now, there are five different ways I could play drugged, based on the drugs he’s giving me. Here are your choices.” And she did them ALL, and they were so nuanced and brilliant. Joe Cross and I just looked at each other and thought simultaneously, “Boy, everybody’s gonna have to show up with their A-Game in this movie,” because Annette did. I also learned from her that the harder the movie, and this one was hard because of the subject matter, the more you have to laugh. When she wasn’t in character, she would tell stories and just be so supportive and funny. The crew absolutely worshipped her. Lastly, the great piece of advice she gave me in prep was, “It’s all about the wigs. If the wigs look fake, you will be sucked out of the performance, so the wigs have to be PERFECT.” And she was right. We hired the world’s greatest wig maker, and Annette wears, I think, six wigs in the movie -and they are flawless. Good advice.
A: One of the things about the movie that excites me most is that it’s a real comeback for Jill Clayburgh. Could you talk a little about why you cast her and what it was like to work with her?
R: Well, one of the first things I think we bonded over was when I told you I was writing Agnes for Jill and you flipped out, because she was one of your favorite actresses, too. One of my best memories about the film was the day when you and I took Jill to lunch, and you were telling her how Agnes spoke and walked and she took a beat and then spoke and she had BECOME Agnes. People forget what a huge actress Jill was in the 70s. She had two Oscar nominations, and was as big as Julia Roberts, and then she gave it all up to have children. Well, I never forgot her. I think, other than you, I was the only 12-year-old boy in the country who said, “One ticket for An Unmarried Woman, please.” When we were working, I remember the thing that we worked on the most was how Agnes looked. We took all your advice. And then when she showed up on set, she just was the character. People are flipping out over her in the movie. They love her, and her comeback. She’s the great big surprise. But not to us, because we always loved her so much. It’s fun to work with your idols. She didn’t disappoint.
A: What was the most challenging scene in the picture to shoot and why?
R: By far, the hardest scene for me was when Dr. Finch sends Deirdre off to the retreat in Vermont and they give her all these terrible injections of tranquilizers. You told me exactly how they did it, and it was on this terribly scary sanitarium set, with six or seven orderlies holding Annette down and shooting her full of drugs. And it was terrifying, because it was rough on Annette (the straps bruised and shredded her arms) and because for both her and me, the scene made us realize how hard all of this must have been on your mother. I think we did only four takes, because Annette nailed it, but afterwards a lot of people on the crew cried because it was just so humiliating and dehumanizing. I can’t even imagine how hard it was for you to watch it.
A: Nip/Tuck and now Running with Scissors. There’s a certain darkness and intensity here. Does this attract you?
R: I’m just attracted to heightened emotions. I think comedy is tragedy and tragedy is comedy. Your book had all that, which is why I loved it so much. Nip/Tuck has all that, too. I never think of things as dark. I think of things as extreme, or boring. I don’t like boring. I like real people doing unreal things that really show the depths of their souls.
A: Were there any films from your own adolescence that somehow inspired you during the shooting of RWS?
R: Well, my favorite movie of all time is Rosemary’s Baby. I loved all the movies of the 70’s. Shampoo, Chinatown, etc. I loved them because they all made you FEEL something, while you felt you were lost in a fantasy. Everything in those movies looked prettier, was more glamorous, was more everything. I grew up in Indiana, very conservative and placid, and I was just starved for expression, of any kind. Those movie certainly influenced the movie, in that I wanted people to feel what I felt as a kid looking up at the big screen: love it, hate it, but feel SOMETHING.
A: How have test audiences reacted to the film so far?
R: The screenings thus far have been great. So many people come out in tears, holding on to other. It’s weird. They are so moved by your story, because it’s a story of survival. Adapting a world famous book is tricky. Some people will say, “Why isn’t Bookman’s blowjob in the movie, and I mean word for word as it is described in the book?” Other people will feel things are left out. I loved everything too, but you can’t put the whole thing in an adaptation. But I know they cannot dispute that I got the tone right, and that I took them on an emotional journey. And people are just blown-away by the performances, and the music, and the look of the production design and the costumes. And you know what so many people say, which I find so lovely and great? “It reminds me of my family.”
